Actually, I started reviewing because it took me years to get up the courage to buy some toys, and I wanted to help other people out. So I set up my blog, bought a whole bunch of toys at full retail prices, and reviewed them. I think the whole program at EF is bloody brilliant, but for some of us it's really not about the free toys. Although the buyout discounts are a nice excuse to buy expensive things, I will admit. less

I DO! I'm not being disingenuous. I did NOT know there was a "free toy" program when I joined. I wanted a good Forum (and I got it, I LOVE Eden Forum) and I had written for other sites, with absolutely NO reimbursement.

I love to write and I love to express my opinion. I didn't even apply for the Advanced Review program until I was here 2 months and had done 8 reviews. I didn't want to apply until I knew what I was doing.

I think if someone admits the ONLY reason they did a review to get free toys, and they write poor reviews and then attack people who try it help, they ARE a problem. It's abusing the generosity of Eden's program.

I'm getting a little freaked out here. I really thought most of us did this for the love of writing and expressing our opinions. Yeah, the free toys are GREAT (although I haven't cashed in a single of my 8,000 points yet) but it's an addition to being able to reach a number of people with information.

I've done tons of Volunteer work in my life and I see writing reviews, for anybody, as a similar thing. I don't think it's something to laugh about, when someone wants to really help others.

Maybe I'm in the minority, I have no idea. Not that I don't like the toys, but it was never the reason I came to Eden. I didn't even know about it until after I started writing reviews. less

I DO! I'm not being disingenuous. I did NOT know there was a "free toy" program when I joined. I wanted a good Forum (and I got it, I LOVE Eden Forum) and I had written for other sites, with absolutely NO reimbursement.

I love to write and I love to express my opinion. I didn't even apply for the Advanced Review program until I was here 2 months and had done 8 reviews. I didn't want to apply until I knew what I was doing.

I think if someone admits the ONLY reason they did a review to get free toys, and they write poor reviews and then attack people who try it help, they ARE a problem. It's abusing the generosity of Eden's program.

I'm getting a little freaked out here. I really thought most of us did this for the love of writing and expressing our opinions. Yeah, the free toys are GREAT (although I haven't cashed in a single of my 8,000 points yet) but it's an addition to being able to reach a number of people with information.

I've done tons of Volunteer work in my life and I see writing reviews, for anybody, as a similar thing. I don't think it's something to laugh about, when someone wants to really help others.

Maybe I'm in the minority, I have no idea. Not that I don't like the toys, but it was never the reason I came to Eden. I didn't even know about it until after I started writing reviews. less

***WARNING, TEXT WALL AHEAD***

It's okay, P'Gell, I don't think that you or anyone else who is in your position is being disingenuous. Like I said, for me the free toy was the icing and cherry on top of the cake, and awesome, don't get me wrong. But the main spongy, cake part for me is/was writing reviews and letting people know about the toys, and not to mention the great, caring community.

I read that girl's review and her comments as well and I agree with you 100%. The way she spoke, she believed that Eden was a virtual "loot piñata" that would give her all the toys she wanted, as evidenced by this quote:

"...But I'm not going to lie all my friends that told me about Eden is all the free toys you get..."

Which to me, looks like (with better grammar):

"...But I'm not going to lie, all the friends that told me about Eden said it's all the free toys you want..."

She literally flew off the handle when people were actually just trying to help her. There was not a single bit of animosity towards her before she started trying to guilt trip everyone into thinking they had been mean.

Regardless of what anyone thinks ***THAT IS A MAJOR PROBLEM*** we clearly have a person on our hands that, above all else, refuses to see that constructive criticism is trying to help them and shows that we care and want her to improve, and is rude to this community. Even putting aside her thinking that Eden is an aforementioned "loot piñata", it is clear that this is a quite hostile member.

I will show you the first few comments here, since it may not be kosher to outright say who it is, to give you all a better idea of what we're dealing with:

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

1) "Proof reading and grammar checking would do wonders to your review. Try putting it in a word processor and then edit it there prior to submitting here."

2) "This seems like a good review, but it's honestly a bit hard to read. Proofreading would really help it get its fullest potential. "

3) "I agree with [Comment 1] and [Comment 2]. Also, you may want to read the product specifications, this toy is NOT silicone, it's Jelly, which is a form of PVC. Your review said the toy "had a silicone smell." This could lead people in the wrong direction, as well as the fact that pure medical grade silicone has NO smell.

For many people, materials are one of the most important things in what toys they buy. I won't buy any more jelly toys, and I'd hate to buy a jelly toy, because I was told it was silicone.

Please proofread. Getting into the Mentor Program will really help you write reviews which are well written. "

4) "Everything I wanted to say has been said.

Proofreading is huge because I had one heck of a time trying to read this. Mentor program, paste it in word, even get a friend to proof read for you if need be."

*** And then her response was this: ***

"LMAO! Wow these two reviews were my very first ever in my life. Talk about harsh and making someone feel really stupid, but you all managed to do it. I seriously didn't think i had to be an English professor to be here but boy was i wrong. But hey thanks for your opinions we all have a right to them. this is so not worth getting free toys for. Just a waste of my time."

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Yep. Not exactly Lady-like behavior if you ask me. She should have accepted the constructive comments with grace and dignity and at least considered them. She may not have broken any rules of Eden, but in my eyes, she's broken rules of etiquette and decency.

/End of Text Wall less

***WARNING, TEXT WALL AHEAD***

It's okay, P'Gell, I don't think that you or anyone else who is in your position is being disingenuous. Like I said, for me the free toy was the icing and cherry on top of the cake, and awesome, don't get me wrong. But the main spongy, cake part for me is/was writing reviews and letting people know about the toys, and not to mention the great, caring community.

I read that girl's review and her comments as well and I agree with you 100%. The way she spoke, she believed that Eden was a virtual "loot piñata" that would give her all the toys she wanted, as evidenced by this quote:

"...But I'm not going to lie all my friends that told me about Eden is all the free toys you get..."

Which to me, looks like (with better grammar):

"...But I'm not going to lie, all the friends that told me about Eden said it's all the free toys you want..."

She literally flew off the handle when people were actually just trying to help her. There was not a single bit of animosity towards her before she started trying to guilt trip everyone into thinking they had been mean.

Regardless of what anyone thinks ***THAT IS A MAJOR PROBLEM*** we clearly have a person on our hands that, above all else, refuses to see that constructive criticism is trying to help them and shows that we care and want her to improve, and is rude to this community. Even putting aside her thinking that Eden is an aforementioned "loot piñata", it is clear that this is a quite hostile member.

I will show you the first few comments here, since it may not be kosher to outright say who it is, to give you all a better idea of what we're dealing with:

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

1) "Proof reading and grammar checking would do wonders to your review. Try putting it in a word processor and then edit it there prior to submitting here."

2) "This seems like a good review, but it's honestly a bit hard to read. Proofreading would really help it get its fullest potential. "

3) "I agree with [Comment 1] and [Comment 2]. Also, you may want to read the product specifications, this toy is NOT silicone, it's Jelly, which is a form of PVC. Your review said the toy "had a silicone smell." This could lead people in the wrong direction, as well as the fact that pure medical grade silicone has NO smell.

For many people, materials are one of the most important things in what toys they buy. I won't buy any more jelly toys, and I'd hate to buy a jelly toy, because I was told it was silicone.

Please proofread. Getting into the Mentor Program will really help you write reviews which are well written. "

4) "Everything I wanted to say has been said.

Proofreading is huge because I had one heck of a time trying to read this. Mentor program, paste it in word, even get a friend to proof read for you if need be."

*** And then her response was this: ***

"LMAO! Wow these two reviews were my very first ever in my life. Talk about harsh and making someone feel really stupid, but you all managed to do it. I seriously didn't think i had to be an English professor to be here but boy was i wrong. But hey thanks for your opinions we all have a right to them. this is so not worth getting free toys for. Just a waste of my time."

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Yep. Not exactly Lady-like behavior if you ask me. She should have accepted the constructive comments with grace and dignity and at least considered them. She may not have broken any rules of Eden, but in my eyes, she's broken rules of etiquette and decency.

/End of Text Wall less

I think to sum it up in the simplest and shortest way possible about this situation is:

Some people are just out for themselves and want free things and therefore will go to any lengths just to get freebies and handouts. Not the case for all people, but some. Sad but true fact, even if they have to walk over others and break rules to get what they want.

And Laur3n... it's no sweat*. Sorry, I can be a grammar/spelling Nazi sometimes, and I was just being a bit cheeky. (I do the same in regular books I read, writing a correcting in the book and such. Maybe I should look into doing editorial work....) less

There is, yes, but her review was very hard for me to read, to be honest, meaning also that a customer or contributer who wanted to buy this product would have a hell of a time trying to read up on it. The reviews need to be informative, as well as easy on the eyes. The mistakes she made doesn't matter, people were kind enough to try and help her and all she did was practically slap the Eden community on all our faces.

And no one is sending her to prison for Goddess-sake, *She was RUDE* that's why people aren't too happy with her, and I agree with them. No one was being a Grammar Nazi here, and we aren't judging her based on her Grammar, we are looking at her because she practically exploded because people tried to help.

And I'm sorry that I didn't include names with comments, Lauren, but I didn't know if that would be alright, so I just kept everyone anonymous to be safe.

I saw the other review that Laurel mentioned too, but since the rude girl's review was on the table at the time, I talked about it, instead. Though the initially talked about one is pretty ridiculous as well, at least (as far as I know) they haven't gone all crazy and Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde on us. less

No you're not in the minority. I think many "serious" reviewers enjoy helping and sharing. My point is that whatever each of our personal motivations are,they are valid as long as they don't violate rules. Its not our place to judge. And like it or not, writing a bad review is not breaking any rules. All we can do is offer to help. And if it turns out they are a detriment to the community then its up to EF to act. less

***WARNING, TEXT WALL AHEAD***

It's okay, P'Gell, I don't think that you or anyone else who is in your position is being disingenuous. Like I said, for me the free toy was the icing and cherry on top of the cake, and awesome, don't get me wrong. But the main spongy, cake part for me is/was writing reviews and letting people know about the toys, and not to mention the great, caring community.

I read that girl's review and her comments as well and I agree with you 100%. The way she spoke, she believed that Eden was a virtual "loot piñata" that would give her all the toys she wanted, as evidenced by this quote:

"...But I'm not going to lie all my friends that told me about Eden is all the free toys you get..."

Which to me, looks like (with better grammar):

"...But I'm not going to lie, all the friends that told me about Eden said it's all the free toys you want..."

She literally flew off the handle when people were actually just trying to help her. There was not a single bit of animosity towards her before she started trying to guilt trip everyone into thinking they had been mean.

Regardless of what anyone thinks ***THAT IS A MAJOR PROBLEM*** we clearly have a person on our hands that, above all else, refuses to see that constructive criticism is trying to help them and shows that we care and want her to improve, and is rude to this community. Even putting aside her thinking that Eden is an aforementioned "loot piñata", it is clear that this is a quite hostile member.

I will show you the first few comments here, since it may not be kosher to outright say who it is, to give you all a better idea of what we're dealing with:

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

1) "Proof reading and grammar checking would do wonders to your review. Try putting it in a word processor and then edit it there prior to submitting here."

2) "This seems like a good review, but it's honestly a bit hard to read. Proofreading would really help it get its fullest potential. "

3) "I agree with [Comment 1] and [Comment 2]. Also, you may want to read the product specifications, this toy is NOT silicone, it's Jelly, which is a form of PVC. Your review said the toy "had a silicone smell." This could lead people in the wrong direction, as well as the fact that pure medical grade silicone has NO smell.

For many people, materials are one of the most important things in what toys they buy. I won't buy any more jelly toys, and I'd hate to buy a jelly toy, because I was told it was silicone.

Please proofread. Getting into the Mentor Program will really help you write reviews which are well written. "

4) "Everything I wanted to say has been said.

Proofreading is huge because I had one heck of a time trying to read this. Mentor program, paste it in word, even get a friend to proof read for you if need be."

*** And then her response was this: ***

"LMAO! Wow these two reviews were my very first ever in my life. Talk about harsh and making someone feel really stupid, but you all managed to do it. I seriously didn't think i had to be an English professor to be here but boy was i wrong. But hey thanks for your opinions we all have a right to them. this is so not worth getting free toys for. Just a waste of my time."

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Yep. Not exactly Lady-like behavior if you ask me. She should have accepted the constructive comments with grace and dignity and at least considered them. She may not have broken any rules of Eden, but in my eyes, she's broken rules of etiquette and decency.

/End of Text Wall less

haha, I think you might have misunderstood me, or I didn't make myself clear

I wasn't meaning her, you, or anyone. I was meaning reviews in general. I haven't really seen it that much to be honest, just a few rare cases.

I don't really think she slapped the whole community in the face, I guess though. Where I am sitting, I really do not care. I suppose it might be that I am pretty relaxed now-a-days

I have heard it mentioned quite a few times before in the forum. It is hard to put a tone of voice in text. Clearly she was angry, but she could have felt attacked even if it wasn't applied or written that way. People involved could PM her and talk it out, explain that they were not coming down on her and help her out, offer being a mentor. If we get as angry as she is/was then we might not be as great as we think we are as a community. I think we are great, don't get me wrong. I just think it would be nice if we sent a few nice private messages to the person and explaining that we were not trying to come down on her but to help her. Encouragement is all i am saying. Even if the person feels angry. For all I know, she could be the next best writer for EdenFantasys and a genuinely nice person who will go on to do very good things. Who knows, sometimes when people are having a bad day they lash out, this may or may not have been the case. I know I said a lot of S#$# I regret.

How did this discussion get to this point? We got fanfiction, then grammar (partly my fault ) all sorts of stuff

I suppose it all ties in less

***WARNING, TEXT WALL AHEAD***

It's okay, P'Gell, I don't think that you or anyone else who is in your position is being disingenuous. Like I said, for me the free toy was the icing and cherry on top of the cake, and awesome, don't get me wrong. But the main spongy, cake part for me is/was writing reviews and letting people know about the toys, and not to mention the great, caring community.

I read that girl's review and her comments as well and I agree with you 100%. The way she spoke, she believed that Eden was a virtual "loot piñata" that would give her all the toys she wanted, as evidenced by this quote:

"...But I'm not going to lie all my friends that told me about Eden is all the free toys you get..."

Which to me, looks like (with better grammar):

"...But I'm not going to lie, all the friends that told me about Eden said it's all the free toys you want..."

She literally flew off the handle when people were actually just trying to help her. There was not a single bit of animosity towards her before she started trying to guilt trip everyone into thinking they had been mean.

Regardless of what anyone thinks ***THAT IS A MAJOR PROBLEM*** we clearly have a person on our hands that, above all else, refuses to see that constructive criticism is trying to help them and shows that we care and want her to improve, and is rude to this community. Even putting aside her thinking that Eden is an aforementioned "loot piñata", it is clear that this is a quite hostile member.

I will show you the first few comments here, since it may not be kosher to outright say who it is, to give you all a better idea of what we're dealing with:

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

1) "Proof reading and grammar checking would do wonders to your review. Try putting it in a word processor and then edit it there prior to submitting here."

2) "This seems like a good review, but it's honestly a bit hard to read. Proofreading would really help it get its fullest potential. "

3) "I agree with [Comment 1] and [Comment 2]. Also, you may want to read the product specifications, this toy is NOT silicone, it's Jelly, which is a form of PVC. Your review said the toy "had a silicone smell." This could lead people in the wrong direction, as well as the fact that pure medical grade silicone has NO smell.

For many people, materials are one of the most important things in what toys they buy. I won't buy any more jelly toys, and I'd hate to buy a jelly toy, because I was told it was silicone.

Please proofread. Getting into the Mentor Program will really help you write reviews which are well written. "

4) "Everything I wanted to say has been said.

Proofreading is huge because I had one heck of a time trying to read this. Mentor program, paste it in word, even get a friend to proof read for you if need be."

*** And then her response was this: ***

"LMAO! Wow these two reviews were my very first ever in my life. Talk about harsh and making someone feel really stupid, but you all managed to do it. I seriously didn't think i had to be an English professor to be here but boy was i wrong. But hey thanks for your opinions we all have a right to them. this is so not worth getting free toys for. Just a waste of my time."

*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Yep. Not exactly Lady-like behavior if you ask me. She should have accepted the constructive comments with grace and dignity and at least considered them. She may not have broken any rules of Eden, but in my eyes, she's broken rules of etiquette and decency.

/End of Text Wall less

I hate to break it to you, but this isn't a major problem.

What it is, is a common, occasional result of this being a community anybody is welcome to join. People come and people go and sometimes they contribute nothing or a bit of useless crap along the way. The issues tend to resolve themselves or get taken care of behind the scenes by Eden staff.

When I posted this thread, I specifically did not link to a particular review because my message was applicable to everybody. No specific review should have been pointed out because it was a message I wanted everybody to see applied to them. We need to treat people with more respect. Period. No matter how they behave first or what rules you think they are breaking, you are responsible only for how you treat someone else and how they behave is not a defense for your inappropriate response.

Bad reviews aren't going away, bad reviews will continue to appear and disappear, as they always have—and honestly? It's not your problem to deal with.

The behavior of others is not under your control. The only behavior you can control is your own. If you want the community to be a positive, quality group of people, then you should model the behavior you want to see in others and let staff handle the rest. less

Since this post is not subtle, I'll explain why I voted/commented the way I did. I didn't see how repeating word for word over and over looking like just a copy and paste was just a bad attempt at a review. It looked like something else to me. That's just my opinion.

I agree Goth. Assumptions without further looking for information isn't the best way to go about things. That's why I looked at the person's profile/activity/lengt h on site before making up my made and writing a comment.

And Laurel you are also right, if someone makes an honest attempt at a first review and gets shot down, they might be discouraged OR they could be driven to try a lot harder. That's what happened to me. I didn't write a great first review either but it drove me to write better and better.

As reviewers we shouldn't be afraid to vote honestly, and I voted honestly. It's not an attack.

I have inboxed the reviewer to apologize if I was wrong and recommended what they could do for the future. less

I think a good rule of thumb, in a public situation that requires concrit, like a review, is to avoid repeating a criticism. If you see that someone else has mentioned grammar, for example, leave it out of your own comment.

My other suggestion would be to be sneakier with concrit -- ask leading questions instead, and the next time, that person will remember not to leave out that piece of information. (For good examples of that, see my year old review of my cyberglass toy from Topco -- I left out several things, assuming that people could figure them out for themselves since the site itself mentioned them. From those questions, I realized that our reviews are supposed to stand on their own, and now if I want readers to look at something for themselves, specifically the view-actual-size feature, I refer to it specifically in the review. My reviews improved, and nobody said anything negative to me.)

If something a huge mess, there's a private message system here, for offering suggestions out of the public eye, and if someone's obviously cut-pasting words just to make the auto-publish let a poor review through, contact someone who gets paid to deal with the grief. It's not worth drama. less

But, when people admit they "only did it for the free toys" it's an issue. If it's the review I'm thinking of, it was horribly written, (I, too, don't care if it's someone's first or 100th review, if I can't understand the review, and it looked rushed, I am going to vote according to how I HONESTLY feel about it) the person applied for Advanced Reviewer the day she posted her first review, there is no Forum participation going on, and the reviewer ADMITTED she only was here "to get what toys you want" or something like that.

IF this is the same reviewer,(and from what I saw the critiques of her review were all Constructive Criticism and she started getting upset, due to wanting free toys) the Mentor program was suggested and the person said she "didn't have time for that."

How could she then have time to write reviews as an Advanced Reviewer?

I don't know if we are talking about the same review. I sent a copy of it to Kristi, because it looked like it might result in trouble.

In the review I am referring to, the reviewer ADMITTED she was "only doing it for the free stuff." less

Viktor— I understand why you would be concerned. And I think, in general, we could all relax a little on the "point farming" and other rules infractions watch. The should be concerned about "point farming" when it significantly interferes with the function and ability to enjoy the community services.

For example:

Posting one or two useless forum threads is not a reason to get upset.

Posting 20-30 forum threads in an hour is quite obviously something that needs to be brought to the attention of Eden Staff.

Another example:
Posting one really truly bad, completely useless, or obviously fake effort at making a review is, again, going to happen on occasion, so report if you need to, but otherwise, just let it slide and move on or offer encouragement in some way in the spirit of remaining positive and realizing that people can and do make mistakes.

Posting 3 or 4 really truly bad, completely useless, or obviously fake efforts at reviews is again, obviously an intentional abuse of the system and should be brought to the attention of Eden Staff—but commenting negatively on such obviously bogus reviews improves nothing, solves nothing, only breeds negativity within the community.

(Just to be clear, I am not saying you shouldn't offer critical comments on genuine reviews you feel are lacking, but that even commenting at ALL on an obvious bogus review is a waste of time and effort)

Bottom line: hyper-sensitivity to possible abuse of the system breeds fear of being accused, spreads negativity and discourages participation—is that the mood of the community you wish to encourage? less